Some people actually see things. This may be gift of discernment. On occasion, I see things. I see things. Uh, like I was meeting with one person and they—they didn't know this, but they were abused when they were a child. And I said, "When you were a child you were abused. This person did this to you, physically touched you this way."
He said, "How do you know?"
I said, "I don't know. It's like I got a TV right here. I'm seeing it."
He said, "No that never happened."
I said, "Go ask him. Go ask him if they actually did what I think they did and I see that they did."
They went and asked this person, "When I was a little kid did you do this?"
And the person said, "Yyyyeah, but you were only like a year or two old. How do you remember that?"
He said, "Well, pastor Mark told me."
I'm not a guru. I'm not a freak. I don't talk about this. If I did talk about it everybody'd want to meet with me and I'd end up like one of those guys on TV. But some of you have this visual ability to see things.
Um, uh, there was one women I dealt with. She never told her husband that she had committed adultery on him early in the relationship. I said, "You know—" (she's sitting there with her husband). I said, "You know I think the root of all this—I think Satan has a foothold in your life because you've never told your husband about that really tall blonde guy that you met at the bar. And then you went back to the hotel. And you laid on your back. And you undressed yourself. And he climbed on top of you. And you had sex with him. And snuggled up with him for a while. And deep down in your heart, even though you had just met him, you desired him because secretly he is the fantasy body type." I said, "You remember that place it was that cheap hotel with that certain-colored bedspread. You did it—you had sex with the light on because you weren't ashamed and you wanted him to see you. And you wanted to see him."
She was just looking at me like—
I said,"You know, it was about ten years ago.
"I see everything."
She says—she looks at her husband. He says, "Is that true?"
She says, "Yeah."
"He was 6'2", blonde hair, blue eyes?"
Some of you when you're counseling you will see things. I mean you will, you will literally gift of discernment see things. I can't explain it. It doesn't happen all the time.
Sometimes your counselee, they will see things. Ye—eh—there's pa— I found this with people—ok, now let me—I'm gonna ask the demon questions. You tell me what they say."
"They don't say anything."
I say, "What do you hear?"
And they say, "Nothing." They say, "But I'm seeing stuff."
"Oh, oh, well tell me. What's that?"
"I'm seeing—you know when I was little my grandpa molested me. I didn't know that."
I said, "Well, let's not assume it's true. Go ask your grandfather."
Grandpa says, "Yyyeah, when you were little I molested you." Grandpa was assuming they'd be too young to remember. So he'd only molest grand kids up to a certain age. But they saw it.
It's the supernatural. It's, it's, it's the whole other realm. It's like the Matrix. You can take the blue pill, you take the red pill. You go into this whole other world. And, and, and that's the way it works.
So I say—tell me everything you hear, tell me everything you see. And sometimes I see things too. I see things too. I've seen women raped. I've seen children molested. I've seen people abused. I've seen people beaten. I've seen horrible things done. Horrible things done. I've seen children dedicated in occultic groups and demons come upon them as an infant by invitation. And I wasn't present for any of it, but I've seen it visibly.
Upon occasion when I get up to preach I'll see—just like a screen in front of me—I'll see somebody get raped or abused and then I'll track 'em down and say, "Look I had this vision. Let me tell you about it." All true. One I had—I was sitting in my office at the old, uh, Earl Building. This gal walks by. Nice gal, member of the church. This is when the church was small. And it's just like a TV was there and I saw the night before her husband threw her up against the wall, had her by the throat, was physically violent with her.
And she said, "That's it, I'm telling the pastors."
And he said, "If you do I'll kill you." He was a very physically abusive man.
She was walking by and I just saw it. It was like a TV. And I said, "Hey, come here for a second." I said, "Last night did your husband throw you up against the wall and have you by the throat, physically assault you and tell you if you told anyone he would kill you?"
And she just starts bawling. She says, "How did you know?"
I said, "Jesus told me."
I call the guy on the phone: "Hey, I need you to come to the office." Didn't give him any clue.
He comes in and I said, "Dude, what'd you do to your wife last night? Why'd you do this? Why'd you throw her up against the wall?"
And he gets very angry. They're sitting on the couch and he says, "Why did you tell him?"
I said, "She didn't. Jesus did. Jesus did."
. . . And there are some people that have real gift of discernment, and I'm not saying I'm a hundred percent always right with it, but some of you are going to have gift of discernment, and you need to—you need to learn to grow in the use of that gift. And sometimes people will hear things. Sometimes people will see things.